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| My Extra Claws Kitty |
Mostly, what I want to do (and I know this is horrible of me) is to just let him go. He has a very close knit family and this will expose the narc. Now, ok, I'm just talking about my feelings here, but the fact of the matter is that MN SIL thinks she knows me. She thinks I'll just throw fits, causing problems in my relationship and go anyway. She thinks I'll look like the bad guy and she is off scot-free.
Disgusting little toads aren't they? What is the purpose of that? None. Hear that all of you who don't believe people do shit to others without a good reason? I dare someone tell me there is a good reason for this.
Now, I'm rather angry. I want this demon exposed even at the expense of my marriage, or whatever. I have no heart to be practicing my good relationship knowledge and skills. I want the result to be that this MN SIL gets what is coming to her. And I don't have to do anything for that to happen. I just say that, "No one wanted me to go." I am in that position. I just don't cover it up with my panic. I am savouring even the thought of it.
I know though that I must save him. Even that email is a smear campaign against both of us in itself. Makes me invisible and makes him look like a single man who goes on vacations by himself, to what? To go look at her boobs again? I mean seriously, are they that great? The fact that she is sending him personal emails and showing her boobs is enough in itself. (ok, not showing her boobs in the emails, but you get my point).
"Hey, look at my boobs, aren't they great?" First off she is not 25, second off she is with his brother.
Therefore, she has basically attacked him twice that I know of. I get the feeling he felt weird seeing her boobs, as this was his brother's MN wife. And now with the email, making him look like a fool in my eyes. And it looked like he felt like a fool in the email. That email signifies that she runs the show, and he is just her little follower. And I hate that. I don't need some wuss in my life.
My relationship advice is saying that men can't always be that alpha male. Over the course of long term relationships it is impossible for him to maintain the dominant status constantly that we see in the beginning. The key term here is constantly.
Well, he is willing to leave me alone in the bush for all those days he is gone, to appease a narc. I know I don't have to stay here, I can take my own trip but that won't change anything. I'm so mad I was seriously considering posting that email on facebook. I have to watch how my temper gets the best of me.
So where does this come from? This need to fight back? Are we not ACONs that have no claws to fight back? Where does this urge come from? Is it that abused dogs are dangerous? I can't figure out this feeling of wanting to hurt someone when all I was trained to do as a child is be a lapdog. Maybe mother trained me to fight back only to get shot down again. For more supply. And that might very well happen if I don't watch and stay vigilant over my emotions.
Maybe he thinks I've done something to his SIL. In my last posting I talked about how I was. But that don't fly, because she is doing something so horribly wretched that is even beyond anything I could have done. And I don't think I was that horrible to actually would have done something, to them, that they would do this. But who knows. Even if he does think I wronged her, he still needs to put me first. So I don't care about that.
There is this wonderful real advice that goes, "The more you try to deny parts of yourself that you know are real, the less whole you really are." That't it then. Find those parts of myself that is real and don't deny them. Hey, I didn't deny to him how I felt about this. And he didn't limit me. He only said he was going, tough cookies. (ok, he didn't say tough cookies) but I felt all my attraction I ever felt for him just leave my body. And that had nothing to do with physical attraction for attraction to be real is deep and very intrinsic.
So revenge on a narc is not a good idea, I should be working on my relationship here, and cut out the need for revenge. And getting revenge would take no effort on my part at all. (I'm awake and aware and she doesn't know it).
I still got lots of time before the trip to get ahold of my emotions and do the right thing. This is just me spouting off here. I hope to send a much more productive post than this in my next entry.
Since this is his family and his brother, let him go, but I know I would worry about the disloyalty. I would try and keep quiet for now else she use things against you. Funny how the cold snake narcs use our real emotions against us.. Maybe go on your own trip without him later or find a friend to visit the very week of the trip. I am sorry this narc is causing problems between the two of you. I want to tell you my own story which kind of applies.
ReplyDeleteI and my husband have fought over his sister. She has not visited us in 17 years of marriage and we have not been to her town in 10. She told him she was going to get him a good job where she worked and we'd paid all this money to go down there and I believe she sabotaged him. It's one reason we ended up here. They didn't hire him. So much for help from the relatives. I don't trust her and once he did not talk to her for three months when she told him when he was laid off in my old town that he could move in with her and should leave me. So he was angry at that. However later we were having financial difficulties here, she wanted us to move with her again. I looked up her address on line to a place I never visited before and found a video of the apartment she had moved into and pointed something out to my husband. She knows I am disabled and she had just moved into an apartment with a very small downstairs and bedrooms up two flights of stairs. There was no way I could move in there and I think she knew this and planned to split us up. I also knew because she makes double no make that triple of what I and my husband do a year together, she'd be running the show.
I actually have told my husband I won't move down there come high hell or water and would rather take a disability apt if we become that desperate at least it would be my own home. So he stays with me but I can tell on her phone calls to him she brings up new ideas. She is a weird person, austere to the extreme, hates emotions and if she is not a narc, she is at the very least a schizoid. I hope my husband doesn't see what I wrote you here but he has heard it all from me before. Sometimes its a good thing to live far from relatives. His family did not approve our marriage and actually did not come to the wedding. Yes dealing with rejection of in-laws too hurt. I honestly feel like she was trying to split us up. I know his loyalties lie with me, but it has added lot of stress in the past. I once stood up to her and asked why she never visited and came up with all these ideas and she went running to him to complain. I am keeping her as far away from me as possible.
I wonder if some dynamic is happening with these two as well. How does his brother treat you?
A person wants loyalty in a relationship. In marriage you have to come FIRST. Some people will try to wiggle in. I know this is why you are so upset. In my case, my husband puts me first but I didn't need this person's pressures too. Your husband just sees this as a trip, no big deal. So I would let him go and say nothing further about it but make sure you keep as much distance from his SIL as you can. Hopefully you will only have to deal with this every few years. I decided to not fight my SIL and I leave her be. No phone calls, no cards, no emails. They talk on the phone and I stay out of the relationship completely. I guess that's how I deal with things now but I stand my ground, and tell my husband, I have a life rule not to move in with others or relatives and let them control me. It hasn't been a problem recently. Probably that is all you can do. I would go NC with her and leave the relationship to your husband but while he can take this trip I would expect some loyalty and staring at her boobs breaks that.
ReplyDeleteHa, I know what my mother was like with her boobs. She would have flung those things in your face if you didn't look, and say oops after. I do expect him to be loyal too. I can't believe he is being so dumb. But for him, he thinks its all ok. He's not thinking how this will look to everyone, him going without me. So hopefully any smear campaigns against me while he's there, I can at least keep it to a minimal. I am permanently no contact with his SIL. Even if his brother comes here I'll be up in my sewing room. It is the best thing for me.
DeleteI don't want to stir up trouble in his family. I mean, look what happened to my family, it would look like I'm the perpretrator of family drama. And I'm not. Oh, mother's abuse has long term, long reaching effects. How the heck do normal people live? Never being a target? I don't even know.
Thanks Peeps
Yes he is not thinking how it will look. I hope she doesn't focus on smear campaigns against you. I would hope he would defend you and tell her to be quiet. I definitely would stay NC with the SIL, when his brother comes to visits, just let them visit but stay out of it. At most leave food in fridge and let them help themselves but ignore her completely.
DeleteI don't understand why we get targeted either. It gets tiring doesn't it? Too many narcs wanting to play their games.
I hope it works out for you and your husband sees how you are feeling.
If there is a dynamic between them, it was before my time, we have only been together for 4 years now, and they live so far. I don't think my husband's ex cared at all it seems. They seem very friendly, and he respects her too much. And he is not normally like that. I get along fine with his brother, he is a nice man, but I got the feeling that he was a whipped husband right away, I could feel it. She wears the pants, and she makes sure he knows it. It was covert, my husband didn't see it but I could feel the eggshells under my feet.
ReplyDeleteIt sounds horrible of your SIL leaving you out, it feels so rough. But they do what they do. Split you guys up, its just this control thing they have and they don't care who gets hurt. As long as the world knows they are in control. I think his sister would have loved it if you gave up everything and moved into that apartment that would have left you confined. She would have loved it! Control. Glad you were smart and figured it out.
I hope your husband doesn't see this either. My husband doesn't go into my blog, and I wrote so much crap about him, I"m scared he'll change his mind one day. Its ok, this is what I need to do. And after writing this, I am calmer, more serene even. This writing really works. So its all worth it.
Your husband's sister does sound like a narc to me. I mean, I look at what she was trying to do.
I'm sorry his family didn't approve of your marriage. It seems like no one ever likes us even. But the rest of my husband's family will never talk badly of anyone, which leaves me to wonder how they really feel. Its ok.
I am glad the brother is a nice guy, sorry he seems to be an E husband.
DeleteWith the SIL, I just cut contact and don't get into it with her. This distance helped things. I don't get in the middle at all. I had to draw the boundary when it came to us moving in with her of course, but this is probably best bet, he will have to conduct these relationships on his own. I wonder if in his case he wants to just see his brother, maybe she bothers him too, I'm not sure.
Yes it is about seeking control. There is no way I could function in that apt, so it was a no go. No room to even put a bed downstairs. So woefully small too, for three people. I have lived in studios with more space. So I think it was some kind of manipulation I don't understand to this day but I knew I had to stay far away.
Yeah it hurt, I really needed in-laws who would offer me some love and acceptance. Perhaps my MIl would have had it but she was very disabled and incapacitated just months into us dating and I never met her, in any real way. She had a severe stroke rendering her speechless.
So I am in the boat of ignoring a SIL, I will hand the phone to my husband when she calls too, but that's it. It's better to just stay out of it all. She lives 400 miles away and he hasn't seen her in 9 years.
Joan, Your SIL only has the Power over you that you give her. Likewise, you don't control your DH either. He is his own person with his own Baggage that goes back decades before you ever met him. And certainly you are nobody's "savior," OK? Please, don't pick up his stuff-ya got plenty on your own plate ;)
ReplyDeleteThis particular Email and your response to it isn't just about this particular exchange: You've spoken often of feeling like you're invisible, you don't matter etc. When you read that email, all those feelings crystallized over this particular event which was actually (from what I can see) the latest in a series of escalating and provocative events involving her, like a Last Straw kind of event.
Anger is a part of Grieving. By your own admission you've awakened fairly recently; perhaps that plays a role here too? We were NEVER "allowed" to be angry, or to engage in our most basic right to self-preservation. The nerve of our abusers, eh?! You view his responses to your SIL as disloyal to you. He sees it as answering a straightforward question with a straightforward response, likely knee jerk style. He appears to be a well-trained Placator kind of guy in any event. I so wish we could open the eyes of the people we love, that they could see what we see, but there's that whole Powerlessness thing again: They truly don't see it-YET.
My late DH didn't understand my decision to NC-he had never met Psychob and I wasn't about to give her an opportunity to destroy our relationship. Even though we weren't married at the time, he was genuinely surprised: "I just don't get it...a mother and a daughter?" If there was one reality I was certain of, it was her pattern of behavior and over time, she would expose herself WITHOUT me having to do a damn thing but sit tight. Believe me, experience trumps words for all of us any day and we are also self-referencing. If I was gonna provide the opportunity for him to experience my raging MN, I just needed to sit back.
He was HORRIFIED by the chronicity and severity, the sheer shamelessness (no conscience, no shame) of her behavior. The question was no longer, "How can you NC your mother?" but "Your mother is CRAZY, scary crazy."
So, IMO your best bet is to keep working on your feelings, step away from the drama and forget about unmasking your SIL to your DH. She'll do it herself. Promise. He's not a dummy and as you said, respectful of others. He'll get it. Methinks the boob exposure thing bought you back to your experience with your MN "mother" and perhaps a little fear SIL is gonna seduce your DH. Sounds like she's already baiting him to see how he responds. Apparently he "flunked" that particular Shit Test. She'll likely try a few more Shit Tests (like this email) and if he continues to not respond the way she expects (umm, notice his replies aren't exactly chatty, flirtatious or inviting, just the facts, ma'me) and you continue to stand back, there's no Supply for her and she'll be looking for an easier Target.
Thoughs? Feelings? Experiences?
TW
PS: To the comment about making you "a REAL bush woman," I would have responded, "If I wanted to be a 'REAL BUSH WOMAN" I'd have moved to Africa long ago."
Thanks TW, I'm working hard on not picking up this baggage. The email did crystalize my feelings of being invisible, which hurt the most of all. I appreciate your help in this drama, it is hard to take when I'm stuck in the middle of it. But if this has been going on for decades, maybe they did have something going on, I'm not sure. But for now, I have to concentrate on my own stuff. I've been at this for just a year now, and I am now proud to say that I can use judgement. yahoo
DeleteWasn't this email something else though? Isn't that a narc in action, plus all the other stuff, that woman had me walking on eggshells the minute I walked through her door. He thinks she is a fine person, I say she is f*#cked. Sorry for the strong language, its just funny now, as I can see what I didn't before and the great contrast.
These freaks seduce men just for the fun of it. Cause they can. Well, as I said somewhere, I will not put up with such shenanigans. Its great
But doesn't that email show such plausible deniability? I mean she could skate away and call it a misunderstanding, but I know better. Sure is great hearing from you TW.
I'm glad you sat back and let your DH find out the truth for himself. Of course, everyone's mommy is great, of course. I feel like I live on a different planet these days and I'm coming back to earth and seeing it for the first time and seeing this stuff for the first time. It has always been there. It takes work to get there and time of course I realize that. I just am waiting to see what else is in store for me in my healing.
I see what you are saying about the email, he is just not seeing what I see. Thanks again TW Hope to hear from you again soon with your wonderful insights. Take care
Good advice TW. I agree stay out of it. He will see her play games. There could be a scenario even where she smears you but he will defend you. He will see her for what she is. Maybe he already does but has some placating loyalty to the brother. I agree about the tests on her part too. Men sometimes notice things they do not talk about openly. He may not wanting to be hurt you but his desire to see his brother is his main motivation.
DeleteIn my case, my husband hasn't questioned my NC. He dealt with them enough even when I was LC status. His word to describe them all...."CREEPY".
DeleteI remember when I would have the feelings of shame, guilt, doubt etc and that was so painful. I don't doubt myself on this matter. And I think its divine intervention that I got out of this trip without me looking bad in the process. I can't go there. No way. And I can go NC without anyone wondering why, they will know why. The smear campaigns, I know. My anxiety could drive my crazy over that but one thing at a time.
DeleteI do feel the sting of disloyalty. There is no denying that feeling. No sense in trying to escape that. But I have to realize there is so much more going on here.than I know. They have known eachother for 20 years. So things are for sure going to get muddled up in my mind. But its my mind I have to live with :)