Narcissists and Boundaries

Recently we had a conversation at q1605 at RumblestripQ post "Just Because" and I was saying that some narcs are not dirty buggers and I had a friend that was a narc and so clean she squeaks. But my mind has been busy thinking and now I believe they are all dirty buggers.

So we had a no boundary family. If you took a bath with the door open, you made momma happy, if you closed the door then it was because you "don't want anybody to see your....,ohhhhhh". And this was said in the most demeaning manner possible. After I got older, I must admit I was the only one who fought this, and insisted I close the door. So momma got tired of fighting me so she did the most dirty and disgusting thing ever. She would enter the bathroom and go pee then check her pee and pee parts, well you see, it was disgusting. This was to keep me from having a separate identity, I was property and I mustn't ever forget it. I could never be this open and it never dawned on MN mother that maybe her child was not like her. No cause I was to play the mirror, nothing else, and this pissed her right off. I always had an issue with this, and the torture of feeling like I was not like the others was horrendous.

When I became an adult, she would come for visits, usually doctors appointments she had to go to and I lived in the city. It was my apartment but you think I could make the rules? No such thing. I still remember this one horrible day, when she pulled down her pants at the dinnertable in front of me and my children. All day long she was playing on my nerves about something my dad had done to her years ago. My children were very grossed out at the sight, and asked her why she did it. She just wanted to change her clothes so started stripping at the dinnertable, no big deal.

There is also my brother's wife who was the complete opposite. I spent a few days there years ago and every evening all I could her was her barking at her daughters to close their housecoats. "Your housecoat is opening, check your housecoat, be careful your housecoat don't let it open". Hour after hour, and constantly over and over again, night after night. They had nightgowns under their housecoats and there was only family around so what the hell was up? The girls were 9 and 12 years old. Also I remember a painful look on the girls face and the smirk of my sister-in-law. I was so sad seeing one of the girls faces, it was painful to watch. I don't even remember how it was for my kids, the whole visit was a nightmare.

It was Christmastime for my visit, and when her daughters didn't pick up their toys, she threatened to throw them in the garbage. Why not tell them to just pick them up? Too normal? She was all about threats and commands. And sadism. I know at Christmas with children its hard to get the mess picked up, and maybe I would have liked to bark out orders too, but love has got to be part of the equation. We don't have the right to make others, even our own children, feel badly. That is crossing a boundary of respect. I don't know how my nieces too well. We are not associated with them. My husband and I recently tried to plan a trip to see them (they live 4 hours away) but the plans got cancelled. My brother and his wife decided to do something else at the last minute, curtailing any chances of us making any other plans for our holidays. My husband didn't take this well, he's not used to being the scapegoat and he refuses to play the role. But I am the scapegoat, and its hard in relationships when you didn't learn respect at an early age. I'm glad he is not a narcissist, but he still can play on my emotions even if it is by accident or a joke took wrongly by me. He understands when I'm being authentic, but its hard not to try to hide and say its okay when its not. We have been together for 4 years now and so its still so new.

I had a narcissistic friend and she had the same rules. Even at their pool the girls had to cover up not just wear a bathing suit. She watched constantly to see if they were. She worked for Child Welfare, so she knew what she was doing (don't question a narcissist). I was wondering what law was in place about this, but I didn't dare ask. I knew the answer, she was just being controlling and had her little slaves in place so all was good in her world.

You don't go visit a narcissist, you become a slave. You do as your told, they have rules (insane rules). I had to spend every evening at my brother's in my clothes in case my pajamas were too revealing, I didn't have a housecoat so I didn't want to cross that line. My brother is not the man of the house, she is and he even has to ask if he wants to open the fridge, I saw it!!!!! I was apalled. The whole thing was disgusting, I have old fashioned values, and this woman made me feel like the nastiest person on the planet. They all make you feel that way, horrible, indecent, you have rules to follow (theirs), and whatever you do without their permission is nasty.

They are sexual just the same as my mother. I felt so horrible, for what she did was sexualize her daughters by being "decent". I don't know how to explain it, they were not treated as children, but dirty little whores that needed to be covered. And, there are no boundaries with this. The girls bodies were not their own.

So they are all predators. Disgusting horrible creatures, why would anyone want to be around them. They are so despicable they will force you to accept their will. Pretending to be prudent my sister-in-law and my friend both expose their disgusting side. They were torturing their kids making them feel bad for no reason. They all do that. And they expect you to comply while you are in their house. Don't go to their house, stay away, keep your kids away, they are dangerous and disgusting and any time spent with them will be hell. They are all about control, and they will force you to give it to them.

When my son was little I brought him to his little friends birthday party. The mom invited me to join the party, as there were going to be adults at the party too. There was a pool and everyone was enjoying themselves, the ladies were sitting in their swimsuits, no cover on, and the boy's sixteen year old sister was wearing a bikini and stayed the day in that. This was a swimming pool and dressing in swimwear with no coverage is normal.

I had a wonderful afternoon, what normal people. There was not one narcissist in the whole group. Everyone was accepting, and its hard for me to feel that good in a large group. I don't think I've never seen normal people before. And I'm sure that sixteen year old dresses in regular clothes for different occasions. But if you listen to a narcissist tell it, they would probably tell you that those people are naked all the time.

Both my mother and the prudent narcs are the same. They are dirty and disgusting and have no sense of humanity.

I think this boundary thing has caused me to fail to connect with people. So when I got around others I was hard, cold, and very cerebral (in reality just completely terrified of rejection). But its funny that I always knew what normal was, but I didn't feel normal, because of my MN mother. And getting around others could very easily show them that I was weird. To feel normal again I think I have to learn to accept the truth about my upbringing, and write this blog. When I'm around others I'm so self focused that I'm not paying attention to them so I'm basically rejecting them. This is horrible. Plus too, it was also the terrible way my mother used to feed that has caused me to be this way. Since I was thinking some narcs were clean I wanted to expand on that for now. Learning what caused me to be so self focused is going to go a long way into my life. I think we will always make mistakes and this is not so bad. I will go forward and make those mistakes and not focus on myself so much anymore. I am actually very interested in people, so I am not going to make everything about trying to control how things turn out. I don't have that much control anyway, so instead I'm going to focus on being and bringing my highest value self. I am at my best when I get to forget about myself and have a conversation and get to learn about someone.

So no boundaries was part 1 of this. There might be more causes but I hope to discover that as I go along.

Oh another thing, my sister-in-law is a grandmother now. We went to see them a couple of years ago, she called her daughter to visit with her granddaughter. When they arrived, she sat the 6 year old in tall stool and stood there and stared and coo at her granddaughter like no one else was in the room, for most of the time. This was all for show, how good of a grandmother she was. She could visit her granddaughter anytime but it was important to impress upon us that she was all about her granddaughter so just stare and look and know I'm a great grandmother.